Merry Christmas to Peter Wilson. When it was suggested that Peter Wilson should be independent of the old board so that we can have a fresh start Peter responded with "That's your issue". Summary of the meeting here: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=594
A good summary of where we are up to by Joe Aston of the AFR, linked to from here: viewtopic.php?f=5&p=4137#p4137
If you are new to this website read the story so far: viewtopic.php?t=321#p1793
Check out some of the AFR articles, too many to list and check out some of the ABC reports: http://www.afr.com/business/accounting/ ... 215-h055ej http://www.afr.com/business/accounting/ ... 211-h02x1d http://www.abc.net.au/news/programs/the ... s,/8626662
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Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Key contributor Jen Dalitz topics for discussion
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jendalitz
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Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by jendalitz » Fri Dec 22, 2017 5:08 pm

Hi all these are some notes from our meeting with Mr Wilson on 11th Dec, kindly prepared by Glen Hasselman.
Attachments
Meeting_with_Directors_20171211-3.pdf
Peter Wilson meeting notes
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theallseeingeye
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Re: Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by theallseeingeye » Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:02 pm

So let me make sure I understand this:

Spillers: “we are concerned there has not been full and frank disclosure of remuneration at CPA Australia. The way your s202B remuneration disclosures have been prepared leaves scope for omissions”

CPA Chairman: “ Show me what isn’t there.” Seriously ??

Then he is proud to claim he is a statistician? In terms of a data set, it’s quite evident that it could be faulty by design and therefore warrants testing; in terms of politics, however, it doesn’t suit the new Board’s agenda to admit it.

The real issue isnt the paperwork. The real issue is that Peter is squandering an opportunity to rebuild trust through transparency and member engagement. The stable door is busted wide open - members, and the public at large, know that CPA has been caught out overpaying executives and spending millions that wasn’t promoting members or the brand. The issue is, we don’t really know how many horses escaped, and Peter is not showing the slightest interest in that. And all we can infer now,is that this is how he will behave if it happens again on his watch.

Not good enough.

JWheldon
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Re: Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by JWheldon » Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:11 pm

It does still appear that the board of CPA Australia are extremely worried about, being truly accountable, given the effect upon its reputation. What reputation??? Ten years of an individual as poster boy, and marketing on its education program. Was Mr Craig Laughton at the meeting as legal counsel for CPA Australia board/management team and to protect Mr Peter Wilson and the board of CPA Australia from the general membership? Mr Peter Wilson, a PR man, appeared to forget his own lessons in public/membership relations. Why, maybe because of the problems he now understands first hand from within the ivory tower of CPA Australia corporate head quarters.

Accountability of the old board members, does not appear to be something on the agenda. Why? This may be because, the old board basically made such a mess, with regards to their decisions and strategy and got caught by the general membership, and not by the CPA Australia systems that should have been in place. The so called system, which they noted on the CPA Australia website, expected all directors to act in the highest standard, yet were only accountable to themselves. To disclose the real facts may be even more damaging to the CPA Australia's reputation. A board, lead by Past President Graeme Wade, who wasted members funds, to sue the Institute of Chartered Accountants, for issues raised by the ICAANZ, which may have been valid, and wasted money on a marketing strategy around one individual, and establishment of CPA Australia Advice without an effective business plan, and over saw the increase to the termination payout of Alex Malley. Graeme Wade needs to explain himself to the general membership, along with the other relevant board members. They need to stop hiding behind a so called non-disclosure agreement, and explain themselves. The so called independent directors, who are supposed to be the check or is that balance in the system, need to explain themselves to the general membership. Are these independent directors really required, or are they just on the board of CPA Australia to make up the numbers and collect a directors fee? Did Richard Alston actually do anything as an independent director, or just on the board of CPA Australia, due to political connections?

It does appear that there are two CPA Australia's. One run by the small management team and the board, and the second being the general membership who are kept in the dark from what is really taking place within the corporate head quarters of Melbourne CPA Australia ivory tower.

CPA Australia's problems are just the tip of the ice berg within the not for profit sector. Accountability is extremely poor, the accounting standards have been ineffective within the not-for profit sector and the type of audits being undertaken in the not-profit sector provide little confidence. The system is broken and those that have the power to fix or improve the system, have not moved to effect real change and improvements.

Mr Wilson, release to the general membership, the CPA Australia board minutes of meeting since 2007 to current. Other organisations are releasing information to the membership, or does CPA still only believe in doing the minimum to comply, as state by several previous CPA Australia Presidents/Chairmans?

Let the members read what was taking place.

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The Nude CPA
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Re: Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by The Nude CPA » Sat Dec 23, 2017 10:39 pm

Well, this is just more of the same... (of what we had from the old board and Alex Malley)

Also, it's not a good look when you can't take a meeting without having your lawyer present.

I think it's fair to say that there has been no improvement in transparency -- nor integrity -- at CPA Australia.

geoffrt0019
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Re: Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by geoffrt0019 » Sun Dec 24, 2017 10:55 pm

I first wrote to cpa several years ago. It lead to wade coming to our discussion group to push the propaganda. The meeting got quite heated. It lead to an email sent to me by a cpa employee saying I would be cut off and subjected to audits with little notice.... Both happened. I personally think it's not worth it...one group of rorters out and another one in. I have joined CA and won't renew my membership....yes I am abandoning the fight but a fight for what.?. I will give my cpa fee to world vision... A far better use of my money. I personally think CPA membership will be cheapened to a point where tree it has zero corporate credibility....they even run courses for non qualified non English speakers in Melbourne...say no more
I wish those that remain all the besT

PS... When I contacted Jeff Hughes about the email from the staff member to me re being frozen out he told me he was already aware of the email and the police were being called in.... My god... What a valuable use if public resources and shows the Gestapo mentality of CPA Aust

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The Nude CPA
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Re: Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by The Nude CPA » Tue Dec 26, 2017 10:42 am

geoffrt0019 wrote:
Sun Dec 24, 2017 10:55 pm
PS... When I contacted Jeff Hughes about the email from the staff member to me re being frozen out he told me he was already aware of the email and the police were being called in.... My god... What a valuable use if public resources and shows the Gestapo mentality of CPA Aust
The police were called in on who – you or the staff member??? Did anything come of it?

geoffrt0019
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Re: Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by geoffrt0019 » Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:45 pm

I don't know what happened as I never heard anything. I certainly never was contacted by the police. this email was sent to me mid 2016. Jeff Hughes clearly told me "he was aware of this email as other members had brought it to his attention and the police were called"

geoffrt0019
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Re: Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by geoffrt0019 » Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:51 pm

here is the email I received. it was after this that I ceased to get any communications other then membership renewals. I had brought this to their attention from late 2016 and I was finally solved by Erin Wood at CPA. She gave some lame excuse about a systems glitch...co-incidentially it was fixed just after Malley was gone !

This email was sent June 11th

Hello Geoffrey,

I am a friendly voice in CPA Australia. I am an employee who is passed being frustrated. I have learned you either put up with the current mantra or get out.

The truth is you will eventually be burned unless you beat a tactical retreat. Your name is already mud. While there is no direct action as such, you will find dealing with CPA harder than it needs to be if you continue as it is. You will find more burdens being put upon you. You will find more frequent quality audits. You will find no flexibility in timings. In fact they will be intentionally done at your busiest time. All for what ??.

CPA Australia now has so much money it can do effectively whatever it wants. The board are happy due to the exponential increase in revenue. They do not care about the unspoken truth that this revenue has come from cheapening the brand with memberships of dubious quality...CPA can spend one million dollars to defend its position and not notice a thing. We convince ourselves this growth has come from strong marketing and this justifies the outrageous spend. Those who know the truth dare not say it....many of our new overseas members are hopelessly inadequate for our industry in Australia but our qualification buys their way into Australia. Put bluntly an immigration scam dressed up in a suit !.

The culture here is like scientology.....you can not question the leader...the leader is all powerful and the propaganda is masterful. All this has generated revenue success at the expense of credibility.

Do not get yourself burned Geoffrey....people here want payback for you so maybe in the short term you may have some problems. Suck it up as they say and quietly more on

All the best

geoffrt0019
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Re: Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by geoffrt0019 » Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:02 pm

lastly...here is Erin Wood email from CPA announcing problem solved
Hi Geoff

I have made some headway from enquiries on your behalf.

We have the correct email address for you in our database but your email address has been automatically placed on hold by the software we use to send large emails other than CPA Update (trigged by email bounces). By co-incidence we have been doing a data clean up of this software this week and you should receive these emails again from next week. If you can please confirm that this occurs.

That then leaves us to discuss how you want to be caught up on emails that you have missed. Some of this information is on our website. I suggest you start by visiting the Board and Public Practitioners tiles on our homepage and the Independent Review website cpaaustraliareview.com. Then let me know your thoughts.

On your email below there is a typo in the email address, so it has not been received by us until now. If you wish, you can give more detail on when you called us I can look into that as well.

I hope that my follow up demonstrates that we do take our member service seriously, although nothing is perfect. I apologise for the frustration that this matter has caused.

If you can please direct your communications to me I will ensure that they are looked after.



Kind regards, Erin



Erin Wood | General Manager - Membership | CPA Australia

Level 20, 28 Freshwater Place | Southbank | Victoria 3006 | Australia

T +613 9606 9956 | cpaaustralia.com.au



Finally I sent this email to the board - no response
Dear Board of CPA Australia,

While you appear to
be bending over backwards to keep members in the loop there is an apparent
lack of any stomach to deal with pursuing those parties who abused their
position.

In todays world it
is all too apparent the check out operator who steals a mars bar gets the
book thrown at them but those in power get away with it because it is all
too hard.

We all know there
were those in positions of power in CPA Australia featuring their own
nest. They were no different from the politicians who abuse their position
by dodgy expense claims etc.always a justification that the ordinary man
knows is utter garbage.

Is this board going
to adopt the approach of lets learn from the past and get it right or will
it actually show some guts and pursue those who abused their position.

The truth is what
happened is an absolute disgrace. I was clear in communicating my concerns
in early 2016. Mr Wade & Mr Hughes came out to our discussion group to
attempt to convince us the strategy was right. They told us we were the
only complainants. Very soon after this meeting I received an email from
someone proporting to be a staff member of CPA Australia telling me to
adopt a lower profile or I would be cut off by order of the CEO (this is
attached). I was furious at this and rang Jeff Hughes. His answer was "we
are aware of these emails being sent to some members and we are seeking
legal advice and referring the matter to the police. At this point I
ceased to receive any communication from CPA Austral except for the annual
membership fee !

I attempted to get
this fixed for over a year with no result.lots of promises and no
outcomes.ironically it appears the problem was fixed very soon after Alex
Malley's departure. Erin Wood, the practice manager at CPA Australia gave
me some explanation about IT systems failure. All too confusing for me and
frankly sounded like garbage. What happened was the threats to cut me out
in that email turned into action and communication resumed after I made a
posting on CPA facebook page publically shaming people and it was fixed
when the CEO departed.

What really made me
angry was being lectured by Erin that I had upset staff with my
posting...what a joke..I am frozen out for 18 months...made many phone
calls and email and was lied to and I am expected to apologise for a
posting on facebook that targeted no individual but tabled the facts !

I run a public
practice. I have seen our insurance protection scheme destroyed by
outright incompetence. I raised the issue of CPA Advice compromising our
insurances as a governing body can not have commercial relations with its
members. This was raised at our discussion group meeting attended by Mr
Wade & Mr Hughes..we were told we were wrong and CPA had received
appropriate advice re this.

My view is regardless
of cost that CPA Australia should pursue those who rorted the system. To
do nothing and leave them as non fee paying life members sends an
appalling signal

I am contemplating
ceasing my membership...this is not meant as any threat other than to
remain a member of asn organization that treated me like the village idiot
when I was nothing but professional and courteous is sickening.

Thank YOU

Geoffrey Tosswill
FCPA1219996

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The Nude CPA
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Re: Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by The Nude CPA » Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:32 pm

geoffrt0019 wrote:
Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:51 pm
This email was sent June 11th

Hello Geoffrey,

I am a friendly voice in CPA Australia. I am an employee who is passed being frustrated. I have learned you either put up with the current mantra or get out.

The truth is you will eventually be burned unless you beat a tactical retreat. Your name is already mud. While there is no direct action as such, you will find dealing with CPA harder than it needs to be if you continue as it is. You will find more burdens being put upon you. You will find more frequent quality audits. You will find no flexibility in timings. In fact they will be intentionally done at your busiest time. All for what ??.

CPA Australia now has so much money it can do effectively whatever it wants. The board are happy due to the exponential increase in revenue. They do not care about the unspoken truth that this revenue has come from cheapening the brand with memberships of dubious quality...CPA can spend one million dollars to defend its position and not notice a thing. We convince ourselves this growth has come from strong marketing and this justifies the outrageous spend. Those who know the truth dare not say it....many of our new overseas members are hopelessly inadequate for our industry in Australia but our qualification buys their way into Australia. Put bluntly an immigration scam dressed up in a suit !.

The culture here is like scientology.....you can not question the leader...the leader is all powerful and the propaganda is masterful. All this has generated revenue success at the expense of credibility.

Do not get yourself burned Geoffrey....people here want payback for you so maybe in the short term you may have some problems. Suck it up as they say and quietly more on

All the best
Hmmm... this seems more like a somewhat friendly warning rather than a threat, to me.

It seems like the person who sent this knew just how rotten things were and was giving you a heads up.

It also seems like the person who sent this was not responsible for you being cut off and audited; it's just that what they were trying to warn you about did actually happen.

This person, with inside knowledge of just how rotten things were, could have been a valuable resource to us "rebels".

geoffrt0019
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Re: Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by geoffrt0019 » Mon Jan 01, 2018 4:07 pm

yes clearly the sender of the email was supportive of me. I brought this to Jeff Hughes attention as he contacted me in relation to following up the presentation he and Wade did for our discussion group. He started to tell me how only a small handful of people has issues with CPA direction. Upon this comment I told Hughes about this email. He was the one that said he was aware of it and the police had been brought in as other members had reported receiving similar emails. I concluded from that comment it was about inappropriate use of the data base, although I did not pursue that because I got angry at this point and said why shot the messenger...every accountant I speak to is either ignorant of what was happening or pissed off at the cpa antics

JWheldon
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Re: Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by JWheldon » Mon Jan 01, 2018 5:23 pm

Jeff, you would not be the only member that felt the brick wall of the CPA management team and board. It is probably the reason why the board/senior management team, wanted to bring in their new code of conduct about the way the members interact with CPA Australia. This new policy would give CPA Australia the ability to expel members, with little avenue of independent review nor appeal.

Most staff at CPA Australia always try to assist the members, but left due to the excessive pressures. The senior management and the CPA Australia board appeared to be the major problem, suffering from the Corporate Bubble virus. No accountability, over paid, minimum complying accounting reports and questionable decisions. There was two CPA Australia's. One run by a small few for the benefit of a small few, and the other being the members, who felt the system was broken, but had no avenue to seek improvement.

The past presidents, like Graeme Wade were more concerned about the time it took to answer the incoming calls, increasing their own remunerations via increasing the membership fees and maintaining their excessive advertising budget, which were inappropriately spent. An advertising policy not changed since 2006.

The whispers at CPA Australia, have hinted at a problem for many years, but the general membership could do nothing, and those in appropriate positions did very little or did not want to do anything.

There is still much to be resolved at CPA Australia.

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The Nude CPA
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Re: Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by The Nude CPA » Tue Jan 02, 2018 3:01 pm

geoffrt0019 wrote:
Mon Jan 01, 2018 4:07 pm
yes clearly the sender of the email was supportive of me.
Sorry, Geoff; I misunderstood. I thought you'd initially suggested that you got a threatening email from a rogue CPA staff member.

No doubt this staff member got "moved along" and is no longer with CPAA.
geoffrt0019 wrote:
Mon Jan 01, 2018 4:07 pm
every accountant I speak to is either ignorant of what was happening or pissed off at the cpa antics
Same here, and the level of apathy amongst CPAA members is a major reason for why CPAA is like it is now. I suspect that those at the top knew this and that CPAA was ripe for capture.

Another thing is that most non-self-employed CPAA members have their fees paid for by their employer; I think it would be a lot different (in terms of apathy) if it was their hard-earned cash being misused by an entitled few!

The Cranky CPA
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Re: Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by The Cranky CPA » Mon Jan 08, 2018 5:23 pm

Another thing is that most non-self-employed CPAA members have their fees paid for by their employer; I think it would be a lot different (in terms of apathy) if it was their hard-earned cash being misused by an entitled few!
The Nude CPA

Absolutely correct. It seems that CPAA members in Public Practice and Academia are the most concerned about what has happened and is happening at CPAA. I believe that the apathy from corporate members is mainly due to the following:
1. CPD and membership cost fully paid for by employers;
2. CPAA caters much more for the corporate sector than Public Practice or other members. Just read "In the Black" and see they very limited selection
of courses offered to Public Practice members in comparison to other Accountant Organisations.
3. For public practice members the CPA brand is not only important for their individual career but also most important from a business point of view if they have a CPA licensed practice!

I get the feeling that CPAA is happy to loose the troublesome Public Practice members, too much scrutiny on corporate governance and education etc.
from this sector of the membership. Their support of this sector over the past decade speaks for itself!

theallseeingeye
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Re: Meeting notes - Wilson meeting 11 Dec 2017

Post by theallseeingeye » Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:37 pm

Grenfell fire: KPMG quits inquiry amid conflict of interest furore

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-42598976#share-tools

I was about to type “at least some accountants recognise a conflict of interest when they trip over it”. On reading the article again, it of course took activist pressure to do it, but at least KPMG had the good sense to recognise that the appearance of transparency and independence is just as important as the substance. Unlike the Board and management at CPA Australia.

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