Merry Christmas to Peter Wilson. When it was suggested that Peter Wilson should be independent of the old board so that we can have a fresh start Peter responded with "That's your issue". Summary of the meeting here: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=594
A good summary of where we are up to by Joe Aston of the AFR, linked to from here: viewtopic.php?f=5&p=4137#p4137
If you are new to this website read the story so far: viewtopic.php?t=321#p1793
Check out some of the AFR articles, too many to list and check out some of the ABC reports: http://www.afr.com/business/accounting/ ... 215-h055ej http://www.afr.com/business/accounting/ ... 211-h02x1d http://www.abc.net.au/news/programs/the ... s,/8626662
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Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

AHRI seems to have similar problems to us. If there are any members of AHRI who want to compare notes please post a message here.
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DisaffectedHRFellow
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Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by DisaffectedHRFellow » Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:28 pm

All

I read with interest the goings on and comparisons being drawn between CPA under Malley and AHRI under Wilson.

With enough experience and tenure with AHRI as the basis for my views, unfortunately I believe the CPA have inherited a similar Chair to the departed one.

Certainly the senior professional members and the board of AHRI have remained silent and oppressed for a number of years. The board of AHRI have not covered themselves in glory. Lots of shrugs of shoulders and majority silence ensues.

When the board and leadership of AHRI have reached a cross road, it has been this way or the highway leadership and dictates.

A definite followership has been created where no one would dare challenge or disagree with a direction, decision or declaration of intent.

From the self appointed extension of tenure, to the annual on the couch conversations with HR luminaries, to enabling a future father in law conduct a key note presentation at the AHRI National Conference , our members have seen it all.

The grand tour upon publishing of the Mentoring book, many fellows refused to attend. Or the AGM being held in the AHRI offices with the employees all directed and used as voting fodder. The use of MOUs rather than Constitutional amendments are common place.

Fast tracking of preferred candidates and a recycling of friends of AHRI into management and leadership roles are the norm. Labour turnover is high and disfunction within the AHRI business, it really should practice what it preaches . In such a small organisation the Chair is frighteningly embedded in operational decisions and actions.

The CPA and Malley were certainly lauded as an aspiration of AHRI intent in previous years, how quickly this has been denied and spun.

Cobblers shoes and all that...

I only hope and trust the AHRI Members can generate the same level of change agitation for the future benefit of all members and industry professional development.

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The Nude CPA
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by The Nude CPA » Wed Dec 20, 2017 1:17 am

Wow.

I wonder how many other NFP organisations are like this/us?

Thanks for your input.

Curiously, have you spoken out or remained silent?

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Brett Stevenson
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by Brett Stevenson » Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:02 am

Thanks DisaffectedHRfellow this is really helpful.

The reality for us is/was that most members are not only disengaged but also disinterested so it requires some members to speak out to expose the issues.
The more we exposed the more that it seemed CPA was being run like a fiefdom. Of course they denied and made threats but eventually reality (and certainly a lot of help from the media and some pretty dogged members) sunk in.

Once the members start to see what is going on, and talk openly about it (rather than them keeping it in-house which means they say to members if you have a complaint only speak with the leadership) then action has to ensue.

Encouraging members to speak openly rather than being intimidated as being unprofessional or disloyal or whatever is the big challenge.

Be prepared to take them on I suggest is the mindset required if wrongdoing is occurring or even possibly occurring.
They normally resist being open and transparent and rather emphasise being legally compliant.
That is the red flag you need to see. There are lots of them so find them and deal with them I reckon.

Being a nfp and a charity they should bend over backwards to be open.

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Brett Stevenson
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by Brett Stevenson » Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:05 am

My other suggestion is to contact the media. They have shown greater integrity and clarity of insight than we as members have.
Everyone carries on about the media just wanting to make news but my experience is that they have shown a keener sense of the real issues than us.

JWheldon
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by JWheldon » Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:08 am

This just goes to show how the not for profit sector needs major review.

Peter Wilson and John Wilson basically control AHRI. The view of the AHRI member on this site and in the AFR article, reflects the tragedy of leadership teams that control organisations, which are supposed to be Not-For Profit or charities or unions. AHRI is at the being of the CPA Australia problems, as the members of AHRI start to voice their own major concerns and push for change. There are many other organisations, which are in similar situation, but the members are unable to voice concerns and desire for change.

The Federal HSU, the RSL NSW, the CFMEU and then CPA Australia and now ARHI have shown problems where control is restricted to a small few over many years.

The CPA IRP review reinforced the problem of management teams that lose direction, tenure is too long and focus becomes skewed.

Has CPA Australia made another blunder with the appointment of Peter Wilson as Chairman/President of CPA Australia?

Peter Wilson now wants to bring in policies to silence the voice of members who disagree. What will happen at the AGM? Will the AGM be controlled to a point that you can only ask one question, about issues specifically prepared by the board and management team on a list given to members before hand?

CPA Australia keeps promoting Be Heard, Be Recognised, but it now seems to Be quiet, Be compliant.

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nakedadmin
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by nakedadmin » Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:33 am

Hi DisaffectedHRFellow,

One of the issues we faced was communications with other members. Basically every person who complained was told they were the only one who complained. Then Brett emailed about 100 CPAs (a tiny amount for a 160,000 membership body) and it snow balled from there. Our conversations got deleted from the official CPA Australia linked in group. So this website allowed people to communicate member to member and compare notes.

AHRI members are welcome to use this forum.
The Naked Webmaster

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Brett Stevenson
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by Brett Stevenson » Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:59 am

What looms for CPA Australia is that this 'new' board over which there are many question marks will be selecting the new CEO of CPA Australia and will have the say on the continuing management at CPA who really have been compliant with all that has occurred over the last ten years.
The IRP has come out and said no accountability. They have been paid an enormous amount of money (but CPA Australia in true fashion will not tell us how much) to do an Independent Review which makes no recommendations on responsibility or accountability.
The committee to oversee the implementation of the IRP recommendations is being headed up by the new Chairman Peter Wilson who has major question marks over his appointment along with a fellow director of the AHRI (Jon Scriven) coming from the AHRI which seems may be of similar ilk to CPA Australia under you know who.

Crikey this really is Corporate Governance CPA Style.

And in the interim many of the good members of CPA who are so 'sick and tired' of the lack of integrity from their own organisation are resigning in protest while many of those in the recent past who have been concerned seem to be happy to let the above course of events take their course and hope upon hope that all will be well.
And the vast majority of CPA members are either disinterested, apathetic, unknowing of what is going on, disengaged.
And of course those silent divisional councilors and Presidents just continue on remaining silent because that is the 'professional' thing to do. They'll express their concerns to each other while the ship sinks and then put their silent hands up and say silently we told you so.
It's a recipe for a disaster.

Steve Hamilton
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by Steve Hamilton » Wed Dec 20, 2017 11:35 am

Wow and here was me thinking the new Prezz was captured by the toxic governance culture of CPA Australia in records time.... It seems the selection panel, supposedly independent of the old board just appointed a clone of the previous prezz and board.

Also might explain the lack of interest in holding the previous board to account. Why would you when you don't think they have done anything wrong!!! You couldn't write a book with this plot, no-one would believe it.

Good luck getting a voice at the AGM, it will be a stitch up.

The new board have nailed their colours to the mast same old behaviours........ The membership are sheep that should just do what they are told, pay their fees and not question anything. If you do you will get drummed out.

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Better Call Saul
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by Better Call Saul » Wed Dec 20, 2017 2:41 pm

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DisaffectedHRFellow
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by DisaffectedHRFellow » Wed Dec 20, 2017 10:28 pm

The Nude CPA wrote:
Wed Dec 20, 2017 1:17 am
Wow.

I wonder how many other NFP organisations are like this/us?

Thanks for your input.

Curiously, have you spoken out or remained silent?
I have certainly expressed concerns and suggested alternate options or paths to take or support. Attempting to be a strong advocate of the Members. Unfortunately as a lone voice, it is easily ignored, avoided or presented as unrepresentative of the majority.

There are a number of AHRI members who are at best ambivalent to the goings on. Unfortunately we are only at the beginning of a movement of change.

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The Nude CPA
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by The Nude CPA » Wed Dec 20, 2017 11:07 pm

DisaffectedHRFellow wrote:
Wed Dec 20, 2017 10:28 pm
Unfortunately as a lone voice, it is easily ignored, avoided or presented as unrepresentative of the majority.
Even when the voices are in the thousands, it's brushed off as "rebels" and "destabilizers" etc.

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nakedadmin
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by nakedadmin » Thu Dec 21, 2017 9:17 am

DisaffectedHRFellow wrote:
Wed Dec 20, 2017 10:28 pm
Unfortunately as a lone voice, it is easily ignored, avoided or presented as unrepresentative of the majority.
You simply need to build the numbers. Every member gets a vote so it's just about numbers.

Based on our experience, complaining to management would do nothing. The only reason to complain is to get a response that says "no" so that you can tell people they said "no".

Do a section 202B request (need 100 members). That forces them to disclose all payments to Directors, in any capacity. Since your chair is National President the salary that he gets paid in that role needs to be disclosed. I wonder if it's included in the $770K KMP or the other employee expenses.

You could do a section 173 members register request and start posting letters outlining your concerns. I guess you are at the stage of making people aware of the problems.
The Naked Webmaster

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Red_Ferrari
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by Red_Ferrari » Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:25 pm

JWheldon wrote:
Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:08 am
Peter Wilson now wants to bring in policies to silence the voice of members who disagree. What will happen at the AGM? Will the AGM be controlled to a point that you can only ask one question, about issues specifically prepared by the board and management team on a list given to members before hand?
Steve Hamilton wrote:
Wed Dec 20, 2017 11:35 am
Wow and here was me thinking the new Prezz was captured by the toxic governance culture of CPA Australia in records time.... It seems the selection panel, supposedly independent of the old board just appointed a clone of the previous prezz and board.

Also might explain the lack of interest in holding the previous board to account. Why would you when you don't think they have done anything wrong!!! You couldn't write a book with this plot, no-one would believe it.

Good luck getting a voice at the AGM, it will be a stitch up.
Control of the AGM wil be important. Can the members in attendance vote from the floor to appoint a different person as Chairman of the AGM? You watch the President rule that out of order if we tried.

On a different note, I predict that any resolutions we send to them to remove the entire board (and any other matters) will simply be ignored, such that our only recourse will be legal action to get them to comply with CPAA's constitution and the Corporations Act. Furthermore, it'd suit them to defer and/or postpone and/or adjourn the meeting as it'd cost inter-state members more money to come back when it reconvenes. As this mob failed to comply properly with s202B requests and failed to supply Brett with a proper and complete Register of Members [amongst many other failures], why would their approach to, and at, the AGM be any different?

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jendalitz
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by jendalitz » Sat Dec 23, 2017 3:06 pm

DisaffectedHRFellow I definitely recommend that you make a s202B disclosure request. This was, in my opinion, the turning point for CPA's members. Until Brett made this request, we kept getting the "nothing to see here" response from Board and leadership.

Turns out there was a fair bit to see...

I would really advocate that this is a powerful tool available to member associations that do at times run rough-shod over the very people they exist to serve.

certified sane
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by certified sane » Mon Jan 08, 2018 3:13 pm

Now the 2017 year is complete would a new s202B notice be worthwhile with information from the following year being "freshly" prepared by the new board. A fresh audit as well. I have terminated membership now so I cannot help but still want the bastards held to account without my money.

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jendalitz
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by jendalitz » Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:11 pm

CertifiedSane when we met with Wilson et al they committed to including s202B disclosure in 2017 annual report. Of course it will include a mix of the old board and new board and key exec positions.

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nakedadmin
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Re: Out with Malley in with Malley 2.0?

Post by nakedadmin » Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:47 pm

A new section 202B request should be made so that they are forced to get it audited.
The Naked Webmaster

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